WILLIAM LEWIS AND MARGARET LLOYD

(Possible their family of 5 or 12 children)

We looked at the Llanfrothen Church records- in particular the baptismal records.

Baptism & Marriage of William Lewis

In 1748 a William Lewis was baptised son of Lewis Jones ( Lewis Mordecai)

On the 17.4.1773 there was a marriage between William Lewis & Margaret Lloyd- If he is the same William Lewis he would be 25 years of age. We do not know the age of M. Lloyd.

Baptism of Children ( at Llanfrothen)

They could possibly be their children; a family with 12 children. Unless there were more than one Wm .Lewis living at Llanfrothen, all married to Margarets !! What do you think?

We may be wrong but there are two? possibilities a) one large family (12children) or b) two separate families (1-7 & 8-12).See additional notes 1) to 5) below.

Date Baptised	Name of child	Son/Dau Burial date	Parent’s name	Abode	Occupation	Age of William Lewis (born 1748)
10.12.1773	Lewis	son 1 .30.1.1774	Wm Lewis & Marg.	Bwlch Plwm	Labourer.	25
12.11 1775	* Elizabeth	dau. 2 28.11.1775	“	Tyddyn Llan	-	27
15.03.1777	Margaret	dau. 3	“	Bryn Llan	“	29
03.05.1778	* Lowry	dau. 4 2.8.1778	“	Bryn Llan	“	30
13.06.1779	* Griffith <4	son 5	“	?	“	31
15.07 1780	Mary	dau. 6	“	Bryn Llan	“	32
10.02.1782	Eleanor	dau. 7	“	Bwlch Plwm	“	34
16.09.1783	Griffith	son 8	“	Ty Coch	“	35
27.01 1785	Alice	dau. 9	“	Ty Coch	“	37
12.02.1786	David	son 10	“	Ty Coch	“	38
04.11.1787	Lowry	dau 11	“	Vottu	“	39
?	Jonet	1789	?	Fotty	?	?
? 1798	Elizabeth	dau. 13?	Margaret ?	See notes ?	?	50

Notes:-

We have deduced Elizabeth’s year of birth from the fact that she was recorded aged 53 on the 1851 census. Living at Ty Isaf, 1 were John Owens (56) Lead Miner, born at Dolwyddelen, his wife Elizabeth (53), born at Llanfrothen and their two sons William (21), a Mariner, and Richard Owens (19) Quarryman (GLASLYN), both born at Llanfrothen
There is an age gap of 11 yrs.(1787 –1798) between Lowry and Elizabeth. Margaret Lloyd, the mother, if she was 5 yrs younger than W. Lewis, could have given birth to Elizabeth aged 45
David (1786) was Griffith Dafydd Fel.Rh Fawr father; he died 1821 aged 36 – these dates tie in.
* We need to look at the Llanfrothen ( or somewhere else if they had left he district) baptism for 1798 to ascertain the date and place of birth of Elizabeth.
The abodes Bwlch Plwm ( 627 415), Ty Coch (621 416) & Tyddyn Llan(621 413) are near Llanfrothen old Church/Capel Siloam and are within a circle of dia.700 yds. to each other
* We do not know where Bryn Llan is/was. It could be within this circle- needs checking with Edgar.
There are 2 Elizabeths, 2 Griffiths & 2 Lowrys recorded in the Church baptismal register
* We could not find any burial inscriptions at Llanfrothen cemetery for E.G.&L (infants/children ) possible. We need to look at the Church burial records at Dolgellau.
We can trace the families of only two of the above children, viz. David & Elizabeth. What happened to the other siblings? We wonder!
The combination of names Elizabeth, Margaret, Lowry, Griffith, Mary and David seem to have survived to the Felenrhyd Fawr family!
Bob Owen, Croesor states that William Lewis left Hafoty before 1792. If this is true, Elizabeth (1798) was not born at Hafoty (Vottu).
Carneddog in his book “Gwaith Glaslyn” states (p. 6) “ Beti William (Elizabeth)….. yn ferch i William a Margaret Lewis o’r Votty ac wedyn o Gae Glâs” (from Votty and afterwards Cae Glâs). The 1851 census clearly states that she was born at Llanfrothen.
Elizabeth is most likely to have been born at Cae Glâs. Can we find any other evidence?

Additional notes

At least we can conjecture that:-

Children 3 to 6 were of the same family. Born in the same place, Bryn Llan, within a period of 3 years - 1777 to 1780
We know that children 10 & 12 were brother and sister ,viz :- David & Elizabeth
Children 8,9,& 10 were of one family at Ty Coch
Therefore Children 8 to 12 were of the same family and lived at Hafoty (Vottu) in 1787 & their parents were William Lewis & Margaret
Children 1 to 7 could be a different family if there were two William Lewis/s married to two different Margarets !!

6 Sheelagh added additional information ( 12.04.2002 ) regarding the burials of Infants at Llanfrothen Church. Viz. Lewis Williams 30.1.1774, (7 weeks old), Elizabeth Williams 28.11.1775 (2 weeks old). Lowry Williams 2.8.1778 (3 months old). There was also recorded the burial of Jonet William 1789. Checks are being made on the burial of Griffith and the baptism of Jonet and the table has been amended.

7. The GRAFFITTI - 1778 ? WL? ( see photos) - on the hearth beam at Hafoty does not tally with above dates in the table!!

8. I wonder if Elizabeth born 1798 is the daughter of the older ‘sisters’. Could be -needs checking

R.Price

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